NOTE:I ask for personal definition of how each person understands this concept,NOT dictionary definition.
Edited by storyeater, 01 July 2012 - 02:21 PM.
On definition of Justice.
Started by storyeater, Jul 01 2012 02:21 PM
97 replies to this topic
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Some people might have seen the <<on definition of romantic>>topic I started.Since I like definitions of abstract conceps I will ask this question:what is the definition of Justice?
NOTE:I ask for personal definition of how each person understands this concept,NOT dictionary definition.
NOTE:I ask for personal definition of how each person understands this concept,NOT dictionary definition.
Posted 01 July 2012 - 02:21 PM
Ignorance is a bliss...until you actually understand how many people ,including sometimes yourself,this ignorance destroyed.But,I guess that,when you understant that,you wont be ignorant anymore.
He who does not understand his mistakes,does not learn.He who does not learn,does not grow.He who does not grow,is already dead.
Moderation is the key to virtue.
Everyone claims that he learns from his mistakes,and yet,very few people do.Ah,pride,is it that you are so well hidden from a man's eyes?
He who does not understand his mistakes,does not learn.He who does not learn,does not grow.He who does not grow,is already dead.
Moderation is the key to virtue.
Everyone claims that he learns from his mistakes,and yet,very few people do.Ah,pride,is it that you are so well hidden from a man's eyes?
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Justice is only based perspectives of people just like on how one "believe" on what is good and evil in this world.
Posted 01 July 2012 - 02:59 PM
Amai Neko l AEC
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I see,,, so most people agree with Donflamigo huh...Well,in my opinion justice is to be able to see everyone's point and realise that the situation is not black and white and,with that in mind,to reach a conclusion that does not commit anything unjust or unfair.So what I am saying is that justice is not nonexistent,just (nearly) immpossible.Also I do not believe in <<cruel justice>> or <<revenge>>.But all that is just my personal opinion.
Posted 01 July 2012 - 03:32 PM
Ignorance is a bliss...until you actually understand how many people ,including sometimes yourself,this ignorance destroyed.But,I guess that,when you understant that,you wont be ignorant anymore.
He who does not understand his mistakes,does not learn.He who does not learn,does not grow.He who does not grow,is already dead.
Moderation is the key to virtue.
Everyone claims that he learns from his mistakes,and yet,very few people do.Ah,pride,is it that you are so well hidden from a man's eyes?
He who does not understand his mistakes,does not learn.He who does not learn,does not grow.He who does not grow,is already dead.
Moderation is the key to virtue.
Everyone claims that he learns from his mistakes,and yet,very few people do.Ah,pride,is it that you are so well hidden from a man's eyes?
Fried Potato
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I see,,, so most people agree with Donflamigo huh...Well,in my opinion justice is to be able to see everyone's point and realise that the situation is not black and white and,with that in mind,to reach a conclusion that does not commit anything unjust or unfair.So what I am saying is that justice is not nonexistent,just (nearly) immpossible.Also I do not believe in <<cruel justice>> or <<revenge>>.But all that is just my personal opinion.
What you are saying is a fallacy and cannot be considered justice, since we see "justice" in our every day life, people have different morality and ideals, most of them opposed to one another, you simply won't reach a completely fair judgement, simply impossible unless we were simple minded people who had the same point of view of everything.
Posted 01 July 2012 - 03:37 PM
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see this is why we leave shit like that up to the government because people are collectively less stupid
Posted 01 July 2012 - 04:20 PM
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see this is why we leave shit like that up to the government because people are collectively less stupid
Wrong, because people are cowards, and instead of making their own mistakes and shit they choose to leave the power of that to certain people, who also have power and money, since they always screw up, people avoid these kind of guilt or unfair judgment and complain of the government for doing so.
In a way, its mutual benefit, people do not need to worry about morality issues and government, even if they make their hands dirty, they have money.
Its a failure of a method, but thats how it is.
Posted 01 July 2012 - 04:40 PM
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Some people might have seen the <<on definition of romantic>>topic I started.Since I like definitions of abstract conceps I will ask this question:what is the definition of Justice?
NOTE:I ask for personal definition of how each person understands this concept,NOT dictionary definition.
A person's individual views of justice doesn't matter because no one's ideals matter when faced with actual justice. I mean let's use common sense. Every Tom, Dick, and Harry (please no lameass puns) has an idea of justice but in the real world, as far as the legal system goes no one actually cares. I'm sure Zimmerman had his own sense of justice, same goes for Demyamyech. But their idea of justice entails illegality. Everyone has an idea of justice because everyone has cute little opinions but all that matters is the law and not what people think about it.
Posted 01 July 2012 - 06:36 PM
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Basically, justice as an ideal is only an ideal. There is no way to have a perfectly fair world. It all comes down to games of power : He who has the power defines Justice. The most any democratic society can do is aim towards this ideal and try to improve a little by a little. But even then you can't free yourslef from the control by the ones in charge.
The trouble is that most of the time you see what's unfair, but you can't see what would be fair. So the path towards Justice is a rocky one, as well as an endless ones of tries and errors.
So anyway justice works with small and tight communities, or ones that are cut off from others and by living without evolving, make its people kind of brainwash each other and the future generations.
The trouble is that most of the time you see what's unfair, but you can't see what would be fair. So the path towards Justice is a rocky one, as well as an endless ones of tries and errors.
So anyway justice works with small and tight communities, or ones that are cut off from others and by living without evolving, make its people kind of brainwash each other and the future generations.
Posted 01 July 2012 - 09:23 PM
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well let's not point out the obvious.. ok, we can say that it depends on the subject and his/her interpretation but that works on specific things at specific moments.. we can also put all of our frustrations in here by calling it unrealistic, or a failed idea.. it's ok for us to think like that, but the op is asking about what we call "justice" (perhaps in that ideal world).. it would be nice to read all your definitions according to that..
for me is easy, it would be to receive the things you deserve.. with fairness.. (remember what I said above and don't say "but what is fair and what isn't")
for me is easy, it would be to receive the things you deserve.. with fairness.. (remember what I said above and don't say "but what is fair and what isn't")
Posted 02 July 2012 - 04:01 AM
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Except Dexter's justice.In the end, Justice is a paradox.
Posted 02 July 2012 - 10:57 AM
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There is no true justice. In any situation, the people who claim to be on the side of justice usually gain the most public support and win. Generally anyway.
Posted 02 July 2012 - 01:54 PM
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whoa there you got your opinion all over my statement of factWrong, because people are cowards, and instead of making their own mistakes and shit they choose to leave the power of that to certain people, who also have power and money, since they always screw up, people avoid these kind of guilt or unfair judgment and complain of the government for doing so.
I meant collectively less stupid in the sense of the last few thousand years of civilization being mostly a positive thing for the development of and adherence to social structure, I mean you can say that you disagree but I can just list every social rights advancement from the last millenium as evidence that you might be mistaken slightly with that awful pessimistic rant you just spat out
Posted 02 July 2012 - 08:12 PM
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whoa there you got your opinion all over my statement of fact
I meant collectively less stupid in the sense of the last few thousand years of civilization being mostly a positive thing for the development of and adherence to social structure, I mean you can say that you disagree but I can just list every social rights advancement from the last millenium as evidence that you might be mistaken slightly with that awful pessimistic rant you just spat out
Well Im a pessimistic, thats what I live for sunshine.
Posted 02 July 2012 - 11:16 PM
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Justice is real but, because everyone has their own opinion of it, it's rarely ever realized. Because we are individuals, we perceive things differently. From right and wrong/good and evil to our favorite ice cream flavours.
Some will argue that there is no justice either to sound cool and edgy or due to some personal trauma that continues to affect their ability to reason. Some will argue for their own personal strict code of justice either also to sound cool and righteous or due to a lack of understanding of the grand scope of reality. Some would stick firmly to dictionary definitions so as to cut out the middleman known as opinion.
I would argue that justice is both fluid and rigid. It is definable but flexible. We cannot prepare for everything eternity can possibly throw at us, but we can define what we know.
I would argue that justice is what you can live with. If you can live with slaughtering a whole family over a chipped fingernail, as much as anybody else may disagree, that's your justice. If you can live with going to prison and probably being executed for it, ditto. If locking a rapist up somewhere where they have food and shelter, without having to work for it (while the rest of the world has to work for theirs), is your justice then so be it.
Personally, I neither have any faith in or feel any justice is served by feeding and sheltering criminals with my tax money. My personal justice depends on the crime, in a karmic sense. Of course, we're all going to think we are right and everyone else is wrong. It's up to you how much that really matters.
Some will argue that there is no justice either to sound cool and edgy or due to some personal trauma that continues to affect their ability to reason. Some will argue for their own personal strict code of justice either also to sound cool and righteous or due to a lack of understanding of the grand scope of reality. Some would stick firmly to dictionary definitions so as to cut out the middleman known as opinion.
I would argue that justice is both fluid and rigid. It is definable but flexible. We cannot prepare for everything eternity can possibly throw at us, but we can define what we know.
I would argue that justice is what you can live with. If you can live with slaughtering a whole family over a chipped fingernail, as much as anybody else may disagree, that's your justice. If you can live with going to prison and probably being executed for it, ditto. If locking a rapist up somewhere where they have food and shelter, without having to work for it (while the rest of the world has to work for theirs), is your justice then so be it.
Personally, I neither have any faith in or feel any justice is served by feeding and sheltering criminals with my tax money. My personal justice depends on the crime, in a karmic sense. Of course, we're all going to think we are right and everyone else is wrong. It's up to you how much that really matters.
Posted 03 July 2012 - 08:09 AM
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Assuming we're talking primarily about criminal justice and the like, my personal definition would be something along the lines of, "What a person or people believe(s) to be fair repercussions for someone's actions."
It looks like a dictionary definition, doesn't it? Sorry about that. It's just that this kind of moral/ethical/philosophical thinking can change at a moment's notice. What I think is "justice" today might not look like "justice" tomorrow, but that doesn't make it any less valid. So my understanding of the word has stretched to accommodate that, although I'm sure my idea of fairness doesn't vary too much from everyone else's. However, I don't believe in anything as idealistic as "true" justice, or whatever. It is, after all, just a concept dreamed up by humans, and thus victim to human subjectivity.
It looks like a dictionary definition, doesn't it? Sorry about that. It's just that this kind of moral/ethical/philosophical thinking can change at a moment's notice. What I think is "justice" today might not look like "justice" tomorrow, but that doesn't make it any less valid. So my understanding of the word has stretched to accommodate that, although I'm sure my idea of fairness doesn't vary too much from everyone else's. However, I don't believe in anything as idealistic as "true" justice, or whatever. It is, after all, just a concept dreamed up by humans, and thus victim to human subjectivity.
Posted 03 July 2012 - 08:41 AM
